breeding hybrids

First topic message reminder :

I just bought a tank recently that came with some interesting fish. The day after i set the tank up at my house I noticed that this hybrid


was breeding with a german red female and now she is holding eggs.. I think the males from the spawn could potentially be awesome candidates for all male tanks. Just something to talk about =)

just to show that I'm not,here's an example-this fish has a real nice blue,but came w/the tannish shoulder.not good!
this one is green-not bad!

then there's this one

or you will pay xtr for these

peace out homies-next class is soon!!

Flapjack wrote:

So does everyone agree that this


= ?

That is a quite beautiful Bule OB and I personally love hybrids. I do agree that they need to be properly labled for sale but if it wern't for hybrids then there would be alot less fish in this world. If I remember correctly the last study showed that when Lake Victoria was formed it had less than 15 species in it soooooo all the species in there now are technically hybrids since there wasn't much isolation to spilt the different species.

If they do it in the wild and create a amount enough then they are not "hybrids" they are a new species which mother nature created, not man. HUGE difference.

Ditto Kory!

im down with the ob peacocks but blood parrots and hybrids of that sort are out of the question

OB Peacocks do appear in nature in a small lake north of lake Victoria. They are not as colorful as what are seen today in the hobby. The lake is very acidic. Collected them in the last 70s. Also collected a blue OB Zebra from the same lake. Hybrids are the crossing of two or more different spieces not families.

Well this is 2012. I have beautiful fish all pure breed I think!!!

wow i think its awsome

ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok ok!!!!!!

Hybrids are disgustingly wrong!!!!! In my book Malawi Cichlids in their natural habitat the 3rd edition it lists 629 different species. if you dont like the species you there is hundreds more to choose from. IMO if you are an uneducated fish keeper what you do is your problem. If you have the nerve to call your self a hobbiest you know what is at steak when you start hybridizing fish. Some fish are still on the face of this planet because of true hobbiest. Thank who ever you believe in for people who care. hey ill tell you what if you want to sell me those hybrids ill take them and flush them down the dang toilet. Its bad for the club to have people posting pictures bragging about the hybrids they make. I have been banned for less. (i deserved it) So in short i dont think people who produce AND raise hybrids are hobbiest. I cant tell you what do do in your tanks, but we are all better off not knowing of such actions. It is a crime in my book.

wow, that's perhaps the best and most solid logic in as few words ive ever heard about hybrids . bravo

{sigh} such a tough thin line to tread. Does anyone know if the pure native african cichlids have undergone DNA testing? is it possible pure bred breeders can have their fish for sale be tested and certified to show that they are genetically pure? I think the purist breeders should have some sort of testing and certification process to be legally bound to their breeding stock.

also, is it me or does hybridization in plants don't get the same publicity? example: pluots, plumcots, apriplums. who knew about these hybrid fruits?

Of course they've done the DNA analysis of cichlids. Have you ever gone to a fish convention? Google Paul Loiselle, Les Kaughman, Melanie Stiassney or Anton Lamboj etc... the list goes on. They have programs out there such as the ACA Cares or the HCCC BAP programs that try to verify and track cichlids. They check on who collected the fish, where it was distributed etc....

There are some examples of some wild "hybridization" but its rare. The few cases they determine pollution and the lack of visibility in the lakes "lake Victoria" being one of the best examples.

Sometimes a hybrid makes it through the cracks (and that sucks) but it happens. However the folks that are doing it deliberately are the ones we have to stand against. These backyard "Dr. Frankenstiens" are ruining the fish hobby for the rest of us by flooding the market with their cr@p fish.

I'm sure there are places that complain about hybrid fruits but it really isn't the same! A fruit and a living creature are night and day.

JB

fishface30 wrote:

{sigh} such a tough thin line to tread. Does anyone know if the pure native african cichlids have undergone DNA testing? is it possible pure bred breeders can have their fish for sale be tested and certified to show that they are genetically pure? I think the purist breeders should have some sort of testing and certification process to be legally bound to their breeding stock.

also, is it me or does hybridization in plants don't get the same publicity? example: pluots, plumcots, apriplums. who knew about these hybrid fruits?

there is no need for all of that. if you are true to the hobby you will not buy fish from people who have the reputation of being a frankenstein.

I never buy fish from people i dont know. I do not buy fish from pet stores. I know and trust the few breeders that i work with and I go to them personally and buy my stock. now i have the reputation of buying good stock and working with it. I let will let any person into my fish room to verify my breeding habits. most of my stock can be traced back from my main breeder buddy to wild caught stock from atlantis

X2 to JB and hydro

i love hybrids, they unque

I love keeping the strains pure!!!

jb1edlover wrote:

I'm sure there are places that complain about hybrid fruits but it really isn't the same! A fruit and a living creature are night and day.

JB

I think the majority are biased here, and true the majority don't really care about plants as much as they do for animals because they are a lower organism. But they are just as important as animals if the genetic divergence of hybridization can alter entire landscapes and how the animals used to rely on them.

I think it's safe to say that there are purists in every breeding culture.


hmmm on a lighter note, am I to assume there are a lot of Mudblood haters out there?

fish forum not fruit lets stay on topic here i dont think i can cross breed a fruit tree in my tank lets not compare apples to oranges here lol

coolfish15 wrote:

i love hybrids, they unque

and IMHO i think you are a fish keeper not a true hobbiest

Let me also also state this for a fact. Fish keeper is not a "BAD" thing. Thats why we have USA Fishbox and various other clubs. They are not here for you to browse the market place and get great deals on great fish in which you have no intent in learning their proper care. Thats what pet smart and pet co are for. I too once was a fish keeper and most of you who remember my old name was a hybrid name. Then i joined clubs and took advantage of the information they could provide to me. These clubs and forums would not be where they are with out the fish keeper turned hobbiest. Please do not think i am snubbing you if and when i call you a keeper. Just know that in my eyes it just means you still have a lot to learn.

sassynurse2 wrote:

I love keeping the strains pure!!!

Best way to go. You get the best colors and so much more!

are line breed fish considered hybrids?? Or just fish incest

no they arent hybrids. if you know what you are doing line breeding isnt so bad. a hobbyist just has to be ruthless with culling inferior stock.

If you have to ask if X is X after slinging your "opinion" around, maybe you should research next time before slinging it.

I am not a breeder of fish. I am a fish "keeper", and a new one at that. That being said, I'm a genetics junky. I fail to see how breeding healthy hybrids - labeled as such, whether they be for the tank or the store, as long as they are LABELED - is some great travesty compared to breeding so strongly for colors and finnage that the resulting fry have horrible detrimental mutations. So long as the fish is healthy and not being sold in some under handed way - i.e., claiming as a pure - then what the hell problem does it pose to people who breed pures?

And to comment on some of the things on here.... I'm just shocked to see so many "enthusiasts" of these gorgeous creatures list the ways they would off hybrids. That's disgusting. These are living creatures we're talking about. If you don't want them, don't buy/breed them and let others enjoy them. Don't slaughter the poor things. You said comparing plants and fish weren't the same since plants are lesser beings, but some of you sure as hell aren't acting like they are when it comes to hybrids. It's still a fish, it's still a living creature.

Quote :

I fail to see how breeding healthy hybrids - labeled as such, whether they be for the tank or the store, as long as they are LABELED - is some great travesty compared to breeding so strongly for colors and finnage that the resulting fry have horrible detrimental mutations. So long as the fish is healthy and not being sold in some under handed way - i.e., claiming as a pure - then what the hell problem does it pose to people who breed pures?

Because you can't "breed" them back to being pure.... once you cross that line it's gone. In my experience "MOST" of the hybrid folks are only in it for the money. I didn't say all of them but most of them. Hybrids are a big problem in the fish hobby. The only hybrid that's safe for the hobby is a dead one!
JB

Line breeding isn't as bad as hybrid (Making) however you can cross the line and many lines have been crossed. An "all yellow" Lab (Labidochromis Caeruleus) looks nothing like they do in the wild. They were line-bred to keep bright yellows and to do away with any black vertical barring. While very pretty in the tank they wouldn't stand a chance in the wild (trying to hide). Also line breeding when gone "too far" can make it hard to even identify what the fish really is! However with line-bred fish you could actually "back up" and breed your fish to show more black vertical barring (like in the wild) and get back to wild "Type" looking fish. Whereas with a hybrid once you create them you can't go back.....
JB