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 Emporer 400 backing up.

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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 9:26 am

My 75 gallon tank has been set up for going on three years with an Emporer 400 power filter. Lately, it keeps backing up with debris.

The tank has been set up the same way for almost three years. It's got lots of wood, leaves, and other natural materials and wood-eating catfish, so there is always something to clean up.

Up till a few months ago, the filter did not back up until two weeks after cleaning. Now, the cleaning makes no difference - it backs up immediately.

The blue poly-pads are rinsed out often and changed once in a while (when they get really raggedy). The spray bars are cleaned frequently. The only thing I don't do is take the whole filter off and clean the uptake. However, the water flow is very fast - no problems there.

So, what should I do? Take the filter off and clean it inside and out? I'm wide open to ideas for this problem.
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Holey Rock of Texas
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Holey Rock of Texas

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 10:26 am

the only time i have had this problem was when i was over feeding or not doing regualr water changes.

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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 10:32 am

Well, you have got a point there. Water changes have not been regular for the last few months.
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Flippercon
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Flippercon

Posts : 1260
Location : Virginia Beach, VA
Favorite Fish: : Electric Blue Rocio Octofasciata

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 11:08 am

D'Claro wrote:
So, what should I do? Take the filter off and clean it inside and out? I'm wide open to ideas for this problem.

Do not ever do this unless you have another filter that is established enough to support your bioload. If a Cleaning is needed only do half and wait a week or 2 and do the other half.

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My Tanks
https://www.youtube.com/user/flippercon84/videos
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sassynurse2
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sassynurse2

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Blue Dolphins 10.


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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 12:08 pm

Wish I knew what to tell you. Yet I am interested in this thread for future reference.

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koolaid68
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Posts : 182
Location : Hampton, Va.
Favorite Fish: : Frontosa, Blood Parrots, OB's, Blue Dolphin, & Cichlids of all kinds.

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 12:54 pm

wow, i am interested in finding out whats wrong. i have and been running 2 of these same filters for years now on my 75 gal. without any real problems. mine only slows down if i havent done a water change in a while. and by that time i will take my filter completely apart and clean it out. please keep us posted with what ya discover.
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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 6:06 pm

koolaid wrote:
i have and been running 2 of these same filters for years now on my 75 gal. without any real problems.
Koolaid, what do you use in the extra media baskets?
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koolaid68
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Posts : 182
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Favorite Fish: : Frontosa, Blood Parrots, OB's, Blue Dolphin, & Cichlids of all kinds.

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/30/2012, 8:48 pm

D'Claro, just some extra charcoal. what have you put in yours??
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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/31/2012, 11:46 am

A filter media by Eheim which looks like white gravel.
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fishface30
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Favorite Fish: : Discus, Angelfish, Rummynose Tetras

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/31/2012, 1:01 pm

would some sort of prefilter sponge on the intake help? At first I thought the impeller could be blocked or something but then I read that the intake flow was fine.

Perhaps some regular vacuuming/water changes would take some of the load off the filter, so to speak. I even take some of that fish water in a bucket to rinse out the filters to clear the gunk of those too.

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fishy
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime1/31/2012, 4:54 pm

my first question to u would b how often have u bought new filter cartridges

this is just a thought if your rinsing the filters out regularly and not replacing them it could be debris traped between the blue filter media and the carbon inside the catridge it will block up the carbon and quickly clog the little screen on the back of the cartride the only way to get that debris out would b take the cartidge apart
or replace
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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/1/2012, 8:08 am

I'm sure there is some kind of brown gunk somewhere in the filter that I need to get out. The water flow is fine, in fact it's fast, but there could still be blockage that I don't see.

Filter cartridges are expensive and I don't need the charcoal. Marineland sells these large blue bonded pads which I cut to fit in the filter chamber. The screens from the original cartridges that came with the unit prop up the pads. I've been doing it this way for three years. When the blue pads get really raggedy I change them.

Literally, I could rinse them every day and it wouldn't be enough.

But this wasn't always true. I used to rinse them every two weeks at the regular water change, alternating right and left sides, and that was all that was needed.

Btw, if anyone is wondering - nitrates are below 5ppm (<5ppm).
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Flippercon
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Flippercon

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/1/2012, 8:26 am

By backing up you mean its overflowing back into the tank bypassing the the filter? All of my marinelands do this after a week. I think the design of the inserts is flawed. Oh very nice nitrate readings. Keep up the good work.

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Last edited by Flippercon on 2/1/2012, 8:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/1/2012, 8:15 pm

Flippercon wrote:
By backing up you mean its overflowing back into the tank bypassing the the filter? All of my marinelands do this after a week.
Yeah, I think I mean that. Specifically, the water is at the top of the box racing back into the tank, while the blue pads and the extra media baskets do nothing - because it takes them less than a day to clog. I would say I have more debris than this filter can handle but it used to handle it.

Quote :
I thinner the design if the inserts is flawed.
Can u explain more?

Quote :
Oh very nice nitrate readings. Keep up the good work.
Thanks. :)
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Flippercon
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Flippercon

Posts : 1260
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Favorite Fish: : Electric Blue Rocio Octofasciata

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/1/2012, 8:29 pm

Sorry i did that post from my smart phone which auto corrects lol! . I meant to say "I think the design of the inserts is flawed". All of mine do this after a few days no matter what. I have stripped down the inserts to just plastic and it still does it. I think It was a design to get us to keep buying them. They obviously designed them to overflow back in the tank so they know the design will bring more profit. Check these out I have read good reviews on them.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=11352

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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/2/2012, 11:43 am

This seems to be the best explanation, yet.

Went to your link. The clamshell frame is something I'd like to try, even though I don't need the charcoal. Maybe use until it expires and then reuse frame?

Fyi, shown on the same page are the blue bonded pads that I'm currently using; I cut them to fit on the empty plastic grids from the original cartridges. They stand upright in the filter box, so it sort of works. If I could put the pads in the clamshell frame I might have a good solution.
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fishy
Private First Class
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Location : sparks nv
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/2/2012, 12:17 pm

if your using the old frames try drilling some holes in the sreen to open the flow up

just a thught the openings on the screen are very small and are ment to hold the carbon in place (they use a fine carbon) your not using the carbon so opening the flow throungh the cartridge may help it from cloging . the pad will still colect the debris but will gane more surface area. and help pevent cloging
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Flippercon
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Flippercon

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/2/2012, 1:12 pm

D'Claro wrote:
This seems to be the best explanation, yet.

Went to your link. The clamshell frame is something I'd like to try, even though I don't need the charcoal. Maybe use until it expires and then reuse frame?

Fyi, shown on the same page are the blue bonded pads that I'm currently using; I cut them to fit on the empty plastic grids from the original cartridges. They stand upright in the filter box, so it sort of works. If I could put the pads in the clamshell frame I might have a good solution.
Yeah i wouldnt even use the carbon just fill with quilt batting and let her roll. The tetra ex series have a similar design as the clam shells.

**********USAfishbox.com*************


My Tanks
https://www.youtube.com/user/flippercon84/videos
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D'Claro
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D'Claro

Posts : 278
Location : Virginia

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/2/2012, 10:58 pm

Will try fishy's idea and also order clamshells, to compare.
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fishy
Private First Class
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Location : sparks nv
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/3/2012, 4:23 pm

let us no
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BFinley
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BFinley

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Location : Fort Worth,Tx
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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/4/2012, 10:41 am

I've never had problems with my 400's! usafishbox

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koolaid68
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koolaid68

Posts : 182
Location : Hampton, Va.
Favorite Fish: : Frontosa, Blood Parrots, OB's, Blue Dolphin, & Cichlids of all kinds.

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PostSubject: Re: Emporer 400 backing up.    Emporer 400 backing up.   Icon_minitime2/4/2012, 3:15 pm

i am with you bfinley, i havent had any problems with my 400's either and i been running them for a decade.
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